SuperMoto Junkie banner

690 SMC valve check/adjust (pics + questions)

138K views 197 replies 55 participants last post by  JunkYardJr 
#1 ·
Since the weather is going to be crappy for at least another week, I figured it was time to do the 600 mile valve check on the 690. I removed the 2 front side fairings, the voltage regulator on the right (for access to the right airbox bolt) and the air box.

To remove the airbox, you need to first remove the lid as well as the 4 screws that hold it in place (2 front, 2 back). You should be able to hold the voltage regulator aside to get to the right front bolt. Next, disconnect the 2 or 3 hoses that are connected to the air and the electronic sensor. Once that is done, just loosen the clamp where the air boot connects to the throttle body. You should be able to work it off pretty easily. Now you have the cylinder head cover expose. There are 2 hoses that connect into a metal dealie on the top, unclamp and remove them. There is also an electrical connector that kind of lays on top of the head cover, it helps to disconnect this. You can remove the spark plug while you are at it. I found the tools that came with the bike the easiest to use to do this. Here's a few pics of the plug. Certainly looks lean to me:




Now simply remove the 4 bolts that hold the head cover on. You might have to wiggle the head cover a bit to get it loose, but it should come off pretty easily.

Now you have the valve drive exposed and it's time to find TDC. To do this, I had the bike on a stand and put it in top gear. Roll the wheel forward until the valves close after the compression stroke. There also appears to be a way to identify TDC by looking at the cam. There is a line engraved on the backside of the cam gear that appears to line up with a bolt at the top of the head right after the valves close on compression stoke. Not only that, but the 2 outside holes on the cam gear line up perfectly with the rocker arm shaft removal holes (as seen in the first pic below. That way, you can remove the rocker arms without removing the cam. Can anyone confirm is if this method of the little mark lining up and the rocker arm shaft removal holes lining up is TDC?

Here are some pics.




Assuming that I am at TDC, I went ahead an measured the clearances. There is a label on the frame that gives the valve clearance specs. Both intake and exhaust appear to use the same specs which are .07mm - .13mm (approx. .003in - .005in). Can someome verify if this is the case?. Here's a pic (had to read it with a small mirror, then use photoshop to "reverse" it for pic):



Anyway, here are my numbers (valve orientation as if sitting on bike):

Exhaust
LFr = .102 (.004) - dead center
RFr = .102 (.004) - dead center

Intake
LRr = .076 (.003) shim= .255 - slightly tight
RRr = .051 (.002) shim= .260 - slightly tighter

So my intakes are on the tight side, time to check the shims. Remove the 2 bolts that hold the rocker arm shaft in place (circled in pic):



Here is a side shot of the intake valves:



Remember how the cam gear holes line up with the rocker arm shaft removal holes? I now took the longer rocker arm shaft bolt and, going through the right hole on the cam, threaded it into the rocker arm shaft a few turns. Next, simply pull out the shaft and you can remove the rocker arm. I removed each shim with a magnet and measured them with a digital caliper and got the numbers I listed above. There were printed numbers on the shims, but all I could read was the first and last numbers: 2 and 5 on the LRr shim, and 2 and 0 on the RRr shim. The digital caliper read 2.54 on the RRr shim and 2.61 on the LRr shim so I came to the conclusion that they are 2.55 and 2.60 shims based on the KTM part numbers.

If my math is correct, I will need the following shims now for my intake valves:

LRr 2.30 shim should make clearance .102 (.004) center
RRr 2.10 shim should make clearance .102 (.004) center

Can someone confirm if this is correct?. If so, I'm going to go ahead and order them from the dealer so I can get back to riding!

I am new to shim type valve adjusts so I just want to make sure that I am doing it right. SO far, it's really not much harder than the screw adjust type, just some more parts involved.

Well, I hope that I have done this right and I hope that these pics and write up might help someone else.
 
See less See more
7
#34 ·
Valve Rocker Roller Scoring

Hi,
New to this thread and appreciate the help. I just did my 6200 mile valve inspection on my USED Private Sale 2008 690 SMC USA model. I had one exhaust valve that showed a clearance of a SNUG .004 and the 3 other valves were at a SNUG .005, so there was no need to re-shim my valves. Since it was my first time doing the inspection, I took some not so great pictures with my camera in my garage. Please pardon the lousy lighting.
From the pictures does anyone have any concerns for the way my rocker rollers are wearing and why?

I was wondering how many owners have valve rocker rollers that have wear the
1) About the same as mine?
2) Worse scoring than mine?
3) or No visible scoring at all?

Is there some sort of recall where KTM USA is voluntarily replacing out of warranty scored rollers (including parts and labor etc...? seeing as there was a mention of a bad run of rocker rollers?

If I show my pictures, what is the likelyhood that KTM USA would suggest that these rocker rollers should be replaced?

If my local KTM dealer who should I speak to at KTM USA Corporate?
Any contact and phone number would be appreciated. Thanks

Well Thanks so much for your help with my questions.
All the Best!
Mike
 

Attachments

#36 ·
I'm doing mine now, the exhaust rocker bearing looks fine, but the intake is scored. It's not horrible though. I noticed light scoring on the cam intake lobe too. My valves are tight at 12K miles, and I'll need to put other shims in just to get a measurement since the clearances are all < 0.063 (my smallest blade). I anticipated this, and I think having the valvle clearances tighten up too much is probably behind the scoring on the rollers and lobes.
 
#37 ·
Dumb question, but I've never actually done a valve adjustment before. Are shims standard diameter? Can I expect to get the right size shims from a friend or a shop? Wholigan has a box of shims, and I'm wondering if I can grab some from him and then order replacements.
 
#38 ·
Thanks OSDude for your reply. I am trying to get a feeling from any members that have done inspections of wheter this is considered normal or should there be NO scroing at all. Please does anyone else have experience with this subject and or pictures. Would a dealership vies these pictures and think that it is or will be a problem or should I just continue using Motorex 10w60 and not concern myself with what I can see. I can't feel scoring with my fingernail. I will send the pics to a couple of dealers to get their opinions.
Thanks again in advance for any help with this topic.
All the Best!
Mike
 
#39 ·
Unfortunately there isn't a standard size for shims. I think the main thing you need to worry about is the shim's diameter. When I did my valve adjustment last year I had to change one of the exhaust shims. The Harley V-Rod has the same diameter shims as the 690, but I went to a dealer ship and they didn't have the thickness I needed. I needed a 2.90 mm shim and Harley didn't make shims thick enough. I ended up just ordering the one shim online from ktm-parts. I've got a 2.96mm shim (the one I swapped out) if you need it. I'm in Fairfax.

han
 
#41 ·
was there any particular sounds that indicated the rocker bearings were failing?

I have this "sounds when I'm off the throttle at slower speeds, kinda sounds like CS and Chain noise to me but? Think I should be worried?
 
#42 ·
It was getting noisy. My valve clearances are out of spec though. Cam chain tension seems ok.

I'm an idiot for not ordering a shim kit, but dodge131 is gonna rescue me with his. I'm placing an order today though for next time.
 
#43 ·
Mike: The scoring on your rocker bearings looks much worse then mine at double your milage. You should check for smoothness by rolling the bearing with your finger while it is off the cam and also check for any side-play. Also, if the bearings are going out the valve clearance will increase and you may start to hear more valve train noise as others here have noted. Any chatter marks on the bearings is also an indication of failure. Is the cam lobe showing similar wear pattern?
 
#44 ·
Drx,
Sorry, I closed the valve cover a few days ago. I didn't feel anything with my fingernail on the lobe and it was hard seeing the cams themselves but I suspect that these llight marks will be similar on the can. I will be sending the pictures to a dealership or 2 in the weeks ahead to hear their input.
Thanks for your input.
 
#46 ·
So my exhaust valves turned out to still be in spec at 12,400 miles. However, the intake valves were tight so I replaced 2.6 mm shims with 2.5 mm shims and also put a new rocker arm in for the intake. I'll post a photo of the roller on the old intake rocker. The existing exhaust rocker roller looked fine. I buttoned it up last night around midnight and did the bronson 200 ride with JBanning and the gang today, and everything was fine. Next time I check the valves, it'll be a piece of cake. Thanks dodge131 for letting me borrow a hot cams 10mm shim kit. I owe you a couple 2.5mm shimmies because now you're out!
 
#47 ·
So my exhaust valves turned out to still be in spec at 12,400 miles. However, the intake valves were tight so I replaced 2.6 mm shims with 2.5 mm shims and also put a new rocker arm in for the intake.
So the new and old rocker arms were close enough dimensionally that there was no difference in the valve clearance values? The bike just rolled over 10k so I'm going to check the valves later in the year. If I see any scoring I'll probably replace the rocker arms, but I'm worried the new one will be slightly different dimensionally thus changing the valve clearance values. I'd like to do just one order for the rocker arm and any shims I need. Thanks.

han
 
#48 ·
I have the new exhaust rocker in a box because I decided not to swap it in for the old one since the old one looked fine. I'm sure had I put the new rocker in I would have needed slightly thinner shims on the exhaust valves. So the bottom line for the exhaust valves is 12,400 miles and still in spec!

On my intake, there were 2.6mm shims from the factory, and I put in 2.5mm shims this time. That gave me 0.12mm clearance between the rocker arm and the shims. The problem is that you won't know what you need, if anything, until you are in there looking. My advice is to order the hot cams shim set since it sounds like you will be doing your own checks in the future. The other alternative is to find out what you need and then order the shims, if you are on a very tight budget. Obviously the bike will be down during that time you wait for new shims. I'm too impatient for that so I go with the set.

http://www.hotcamsinc.com/index.cfm

Their website sucks the big dong so you should call them or get the kit from another vendor. You need 10mm O.D. shims for the 690 engines.
 
#49 ·
I hear ya,
It is great having a resource to discuss this possible issue although it would be great to get POLL on the percentage of bikes that show rocker wear to use as information for KTM USA?
Do you think that if a dealer sees these pictures they would say that there should not be wear marks on the rollers or the cams? If they say that it is not normal then why would KTMUSA NOT pick up a complete replacement of the ill manufactured Rocker assemblies and cam if needed? I mean the owners manual says to inspect valves at 10KM, it does not say to replace Rocker Assemblies and a cam. Is there a thread where someone on this group or any group for that matter brought this problem to the attention of KTM USA and what was their response to this wear?
Do you think I can leave my rockers until my next check at 12K Miles?
Also what are the approx costs of a rocker assembly (rt or left)?
What is the cost of the cam assembly?
Shim cost per shim?
Thanks again

Thanks
 
#50 ·
I'm pretty sure the manual says every 6K miles for valve clearance checks. At any rate, the shim kit will cost around $70 I think. You don't need a cam unless you want to put a duke cam in there. I'm gonna try the duke cam next time, in fact. New rockers are around $60. Just take photos, save your receipts, try to document it with a shop. I'll post a thread about this and include a poll. I think pretty much everyone sees this happening on the rocker roller bearings. I know of at least one sure case of top end failure at around 17K miles, precisely due to rocker arm roller bearing failure.

I'm pretty sure there is someone on here who posted that he'd exchange shims with people for free or near free. I don't remember what thread it was in though. If you do an advanced search with the keyword "shims" and my username, you'll probably find it.
 
#53 ·
I wonder if there could be other reasons for ticking, since my rockers seams to be ok.
I wonder about the auto decomp mechanism.
My auto decomp spring seems very weak. It requires almost no force to move the weight by hand. Is this how it should be?
I've heard the intermittent loud ticking could be from the cam chain tensioner too. What I can tell you is that I bought mine with 4300 miles on it, and it sounded great. I put maybe 3 or 4K miles on it, and it started some loud ticking after hot starts. Not often, but then it became more frequent. At around 12K miles, I replaced the intake rocker because the roller was scored. Now I've put about 2K miles on the bike and have not heard the hot start ticking noise once. I conclude from this that my ticking was from the intake rocker arm bearing failing and the cam lobe hitting and dragging on it.
 
#54 · (Edited)
Today I have checked valve clearance on my 690 enduro EU 2008 model. I bought used bike with 11000km on it. Since i can only get ones with 0.05, 0.1, 0.15mm thickness iam not sure if my valves r in spec after I check them. Valve clearance should be 0.1mm with +/-0.03mm tolerance (this is how it see 0.07-0.13mm valve clearance from manual)

This is what i have found/did:

So 0.05mm feeler gauge fits easy under all valves with almost no drag when pulling out and no problem at all. So i asume all valves r well above 0.05mm mark.

Now 0.1mm feeler gauge fits under exhaust valves with some drag, takes little effort to get feeler gauge in but not much so i think exhaust valves are round 0.1mm clearance. On the intake side 1st valve could fit 0.1mm but it had fair ammount of drag and it little bit more effort to get it in then on exhaust side, on the 2nd valve i could not even fit it in. So i asume 1st valve has 0.1mm clearance or little less but 2nd one is closer to 0.07mm since i cant fit 0.1mm gauge? So I used 1000/600 sand paper on 2nd valve shim and grind it a bit, I didnt even sand 0.025mm from it but I did decide to check clearance anyway just to make sure I dont over do it. It turned out that after that little bit of sanding i could fit 0.1 gauge under both intake valves and had more/less equal and fair ammount of drag with some effort to get the feeler gauge in.

I could not put 0.15mm feeler gauge under any valve. I concluded that iam well below 0.15mm clearance for all valves.

On my test run i could hear valves ticking. I think thats normal and better then not to be able to hear them ticking.

Since its my first time doing this I need do be sure that Iam doing this properly and getting to right conclusions.
 
#56 ·
Most likely you will not be able to sand them down. The shims are hardened steel and only true way to get them thinner is to put them on a surface grinder. That way you know they are flat and true. And yes get a feeler gauge set.
 
#163 ·
Any difference between the pro-x shim kit and the hot cam kit?
pro-x http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/2839/24277/Pro-X-Valve-Shim-Kit?ref=gmc&gclid=CJT45ozy9LoCFUMV7AodB18AMg
hot cams http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/922/-/832279/Hot-Cams-Valve-Shim-Kit-10.0mm-OD?v=8691
I am trying to order one for my 2008 KTM 690 SMC. I have almost 20,000miles I have owned her since 14,000. Planning on owning her forever :D So Im getting a shim kit and going to order rocker arms just to be safe. Where did you all order yours? I think I'm going to get the shim kit from rocky mountain tav/mc since they are 1 day shipping to CA most of the time.
 
#58 · (Edited)
Most likely you will not be able to sand them down. The shims are hardened steel and only true way to get them thinner is to put them on a surface grinder. That way you know they are flat and true. And yes get a feeler gauge set.
I already did sand it since before sanding i could not put 0.1mm feeler gauge in and after sanding I could. KTM dealer in my country says they sand them down if needed wich is next logical step if u have measured 0.07mm or 0.13mm clearance since u can only get shims in 0.05mm steps.

I will try to get better feeler gauge set. It seams hard to get proper set in my country.
 
#60 ·
Nope, not dumb. Indeed, that is the gap you are measuring. You want the feeler blade to grab but not hang tight. You should not have to use a lot of force but also you should have to be deliberate about getting the blade in and out. If you think about it, there is no way you can compress the spring with a blade that is too large so there's no danger of over estimating the gap. There is plenty of danger in underestimating though. Still, too-small clearances are worse than too-large.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top